[00:00:02] kalken: well yeah, that is a problem particular groups may experience (trolls) but others may not, rbose and apollo-ng would be to groups co-existing with different focusses but same goasl without the right wrong yadayada :) [00:00:14] two groups [00:00:24] :] [00:03:30] chrono: we are not "connector/administrator", we are just a node, one of many :) we for sure don't pretend to manage others - beside our hardware, culture and software projects, and activism in different areas, we just gather information from these fields, because at the point we started nobody seemed to do that - and what we experienced ourselves in the foss community: people who worked with software often [00:03:30] had no idea about hardware projects, or free music, or stuff like natural constructions and food independence in a world of licensed plants and life patents - these two last can really help with bringing freedom to human habitats, freeing from slavery - oh and many people here has a good understanding how the economy of credit monopoly with value based on scarcity works [00:04:28] i would like to share an observation I made today, when I got sidetracked in youtube, I came to some records of public tv reports about alternative energy [00:05:11] i must have seen about 20-30 videos, and all public tv (MDR) the people kept repeating the following sentence like a mantra in almost ALL videos I saw: [00:05:29] "This is a new technology and it is patented" [00:05:48] over and over again, always implying that this makes the product even better, because it IS patented [00:05:56] yeah :( [00:06:11] thats why its called the lolworld :D [00:06:20] lol [00:07:11] i have no Tv for 10 years, so I don't get the usual brainwash, but it really set me straight on how manipulative even non-private "journalism has become publicly [00:07:22] and in the other end sits all these economists talking about infinite growth and "inflation expectations" as something great. [00:07:36] I always like to say: " You can piss on my face, just don't tell me it's raining" [00:08:03] people trying to figure out how to get more and more money, when the real problem is that everyone is expected to sell out to the highest bidder [00:08:37] ha lol [00:08:51] speaking of economy, I can really recommend the last southpark episode [00:08:57] what patent does, it makes it more scarce, this way higher value is created in the outdated exchange value system [00:09:22] it really shows the stupidity, and extortion :) [00:10:14] it also creates this environment where people learn to be so self centered, so they end up with a world view where they se them selves separated from their surroundings. [00:10:59] ,quote get #178 [00:10:59] lukas: (quote get [] ) -- Gets the quote with id from the quote database for . is only necessary if the message isn't sent in the channel itself. [00:11:15] michel hoellebeq wrote two books about that I consider real mind-openers, I only know the german titles "Elementarteilchen" und vor allem "Ausweitung der Kampfzone" [00:11:18] ,quote get 178 [00:11:18] lukas: Quote #178: "Trade is a situation where two people try to get as much as possible for as little as possible, and optimizing that situation will turn out to shit, for some part. ~ kalken" (added by lukas at 09:32 AM, June 10, 2011) [00:11:31] lol [00:11:33] :) [00:11:54] haha [00:11:56] ,qr [00:11:56] DNS777: Quote #213: "God gave me my money. ~ John D. Rockefeller" (added by lukas at 01:43 PM, January 25, 2012) [00:12:01] 0_o [00:12:05] lol [00:13:17] i found it in wikisource of wikimedia :) [00:14:36] The great moral question of the twenty-first century is this: if all knowing, all culture, all art, all useful information can be costlessly given to everyone at the same price that it is given to anyone; if everyone can have everything, anywhere, all the time, why is it ever moral to exclude anyone? ~Eben Moglen [00:14:36] ,qr [00:14:36] lukas: Quote #187: "everytime i go to sleep i will now knee in front of my bed and pray to moglen forgive me my sins that i ever used m$ windows ~ DNS" (added by lukas at 08:40 PM, July 09, 2011) [00:14:54] lol [00:15:07] kalken: yeah, that is a great question! [00:15:38] i need to go guys, have a great time [00:16:16] !hug lukas [00:16:17] ACTION hugs lukas for kalken and hopes that lukas enjoys it :) [00:16:18] you also use ref=nofollow for your project links? [00:16:59] do you consider the projects you link to as not related in the context of rbose work? [00:17:21] because that is exactly what rel=nofollow communicates to search engines [00:18:29] !hug nobody [00:18:29] ACTION hugs nobody for chrono and hopes that nobody enjoys it :) [00:20:01] !hug missboty [00:20:03] ACTION hugs missboty and smiles :) [00:20:11] hehe [00:20:24] *** Joins: Kebap (Max@RBOSE-6q3mmu.adsl.hansenet.de) [00:22:35] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0KTUysrwgQ [00:22:36] You4Tube 2[Title] Kara - Heavy Rain's Dev Trailer 2[Category] Games 2[Duration] 0:07:02 2[Views] 401541 2[Rating] 4.94 2[Uploaded] 2012-03-08 2[Description] This is the new tech developer Quantic Dream is working with -- but it's not Quantic Dream's new game. Never the less, this near flawless cinematic will turn many heads, so stay tuned as we will have more to come! See all of IGN's coverage at GDC here: http://www.ign.com/events [00:23:30] unfortunately mediawiki has nofollow enabled by default and it should be disabled imho. link popularity is an important thing we should take advantage of, so that people will find the content of the groups website before they find commercial stuff when they look for something on the net [00:26:20] like if someone is googling for "shoes" they should find open-resource content before commercial shoe products, like how to make nice shos yourself... but we can only achieve that by better search engine placement and that requires not using rel=nofollow [00:27:47] we proclaim sharing as our motto but we don't share link popularity :) [00:27:55] *** Quits: Kebap23 (Max@RBOSE-nt7qrr.adsl.alicedsl.de) (Ping timeout: 241 seconds) [00:37:18] chrono: i think this topic may need some attention, but wouldn't expect anyone to get on it right now ;) [00:37:51] !help [00:40:26] hmmmm.... i can't chat to missboty on priv somehow :( [00:40:39] !help missboty [00:40:40] ACTION greets missboty (because elf-pavlik wants me to), and offers some help. (Type: !help) [00:44:07] lol [00:44:41] its a security setting [00:44:53] it only works with registered nicks [00:45:17] the bot recongizes user mode +R [00:46:06] elf-pavlik: it's important [00:46:23] elf-pavlik: I mentioned the same thoughts to the hackerspaces.org guys [00:48:35] they also use mediawiki and also rel=nofollow thereby harvesting any link popularity regarding the keywords hackerspaces but not sharing that with related projects which all drop massively down in search results [00:49:03] chrono: but than you need to deal with spam... [00:49:13] DNS777: ok, thx for info! [00:49:16] it's such a simple algorithm, the bot is just rational code [00:49:25] elf-pavlik: you need to deal with spam either way [00:49:59] it's a myth, even wiki founders who "invented" that monster now tend to agree that it didn't work as they intended to [00:50:01] afaik nofollow makes it bit less attactive to spammers ;) [00:50:49] well, speaking bluntly, there are also less attractive woman on the planet, but they still find enough guys who fuck them! [00:51:18] rofl @ chrono [00:51:45] chrono: http://pms.rbose.org/projects/mwiki ? [00:51:46] URL Title: Wiki - Overview - RBOSE PMS [00:52:50] http://pms.rbose.org/projects [00:52:51] URL Title: Projects - RBOSE PMS [00:53:39] needs to be updated [00:53:42] ah [00:53:44] interesting [00:53:50] the pms has clean links [00:53:59] but myself is quite lazy when it comes about documentation at all in last time :x [00:54:23] yeah, most of us hackers really are having a bad time when it comes to documentation [00:55:23] but we need to do it, in order to make it transferable, I try to pick one topic a day and work at it, until I feel that i've overstated my doc time ;) that way things are still getting done [00:59:49] sicne the rbose wiki is not publicly editable there shouldn't be any problems with spam anyways, so even less reason to keep rel=nofollow [01:00:13] anyhow, I'd really like you to consider this, I'm going bubu now :) [01:00:43] sharing links popularity is equally important to sharing knowledge and other resources [01:08:21] we had some spammers in wiki already [01:08:33] but in last time not [03:05:59] *** Quits: Guest76889 (tom@RBOSE-a2hinp.gtom.eu) (Connection closed) [03:31:27] *** Joins: gtom (tom@RBOSE-a2hinp.gtom.eu) [03:31:57] *** gtom is now known as Guest71420 [03:34:48] *** Quits: DZR (Darren@RBOSE-cvq.271.4.190.IP) (Ping timeout: 241 seconds) [07:38:35] *** Joins: ZyaX (9jti8d8@RBOSE-5lntnm.bredband.comhem.se) [08:57:47] *** Quits: ZyaX (9jti8d8@RBOSE-5lntnm.bredband.comhem.se) (Ping timeout: 241 seconds) [09:59:56] heyho:) [10:40:27] *** Joins: Caly (Caly@RBOSE-o4h7cd.mobileonline.telia.com) [10:40:32] -nobody- Calyp has joined on FREENODE [10:40:34] -nobody- Calyp has quit FREENODE (Changing host) [10:40:35] -nobody- Calyp has joined on FREENODE [10:40:37] -nobody- mode change by ChanServ on FREENODE: +v Calyp [11:34:15] -nobody- Calyp has quit FREENODE (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) [11:37:54] *** Quits: Caly (Caly@RBOSE.org) (Ping timeout: 241 seconds) [12:22:34] *** Joins: Caly (Caly@RBOSE-g9b2va.mobileonline.telia.com) [12:23:58] wb caly :) [12:24:17] tnx chrono [12:25:45] *** Quits: Caly (Caly@RBOSE.org) (Quit: Laters y'all) [12:26:00] -nobody- Calyp has joined on FREENODE [12:26:02] -nobody- Calyp has quit FREENODE (Changing host) [12:26:03] -nobody- Calyp has joined on FREENODE [12:26:05] -nobody- mode change by ChanServ on FREENODE: +v Calyp [12:26:14] *** Joins: Caly (Caly@RBOSE-g9b2va.mobileonline.telia.com) [13:02:21] -nobody- Calyp has quit FREENODE (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) [13:05:56] *** Quits: Caly (Caly@RBOSE.org) (Ping timeout: 241 seconds) [15:19:48] *** Joins: DZR (Darren@RBOSE-cvq.271.4.190.IP) [15:20:59] Hello :) [15:23:39] howdy:) [15:24:10] How you doing chrono [15:24:43] Was reading about Helios [15:25:15] nice [15:25:23] I recently finished making a TLSD wood gasiying stove :) [15:25:28] *** Joins: Caly (Caly@RBOSE-ef9mle.mobileonline.telia.com) [15:25:43] SD? [15:25:44] Also bought a high remp TEG from Thermalforce for a friend to play with [15:25:52] side draft [15:26:07] interesting [15:26:09] He managed to melt the TEG :( [15:26:30] that's why I wanted the tlud with a movable block around the chmaber [15:26:41] if it get's too hot, the uC control the motor to move the block [15:26:47] DNS777: yo, what was the system you recently showed me dumps from? Mint+LXDE or what was it? [15:26:57] trying to keep 250° hot side temperature [15:26:59] He was using it on a wood stove and getting very excited about the output high output he was getting [15:27:07] to always get maximum DeltaT AND to keep the TEG safe [15:27:33] He had a PC cooling fan blowing onto a heat sink [15:27:55] Hes been playing making a better housing while he saves money for a new TEG [15:28:02] I am not sure yet if one get really get away with just air cooling [15:28:23] Buying from Thermalforce to the UK makes single TEGs very expensive [15:28:29] thats why I kept that part of the design open for now, until preliminary tests and measurements were taken [15:28:38] 20 postage + bank fees to transfer money to a foreign bank [15:28:46] A peltier element + a PC fan would be a nice "turbo" for a stove =P [15:28:50] indeed, solid-state always scales price with volume, TEG's are not exception :( [15:29:06] Caly: thats the concept of helios [15:29:11] I got lots and lots of help designing my stove from the stoves mailing list [15:29:16] do you know it??? [15:29:17] aha [15:29:17] but not only a fan, thats arady been built into some tluds [15:29:30] oh, ok [15:29:31] but to really control the air volume and primary/secondary air flow ratio [15:29:55] DZR: I don't think I do, are people like paul anderson on it? [15:29:58] you said something about thermoconductors or something, I suspected you meant peltiers [15:30:07] no [15:30:12] i mean TEGs [15:30:39] Lots of knowledgeable / helpful people on it..... [15:31:05] peltiers and TEGs both base on the so called seebeck-effect, but peltiers are designed to convert power into hot/cold and tegs are designed to convert hot/cold DeltaT into power [15:31:37] it's way less efficient to use a peltier for generate power [15:31:41] Its been going for years and years http://www.bioenergylists.org/ [15:31:42] URL Title: Improved Biomass Cooking Stoves | This site exists to help people develop better stoves for cooking with biomass fuels in developing regions. [15:32:04] aha, ok, but peltiers can be used as generators just the same, but I guess TEG's are optimised for it then...? [15:32:38] sure you can, but it doesn't really make sense :) [15:33:30] Thats the related website - the list is http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org [15:33:31] URL Title: Stoves Info Page [15:33:35] like the biolite guys do, putting a crappy peltier in there so that you can charge an iphone, wtf.... [15:34:07] the people who need that kind of stove to live usually don't have a smartphone they need to charge [15:35:01] either you generate useful amounts of power, so that you generates enough electriciy to run high power LED's in the night to convert biomass-energy into more useful energy than just heat for cooking [15:35:31] A few people have posted links on that list to 'commercial product' TLUD stoves with TEGs aimed for market / development in countries without electricity grids [15:36:14] and also, if the system is designed properly, the cooling of the TEG's with water may be used to heat something else (in colder regions for exmaple, to heat a room, TLUDS generate enough BTU's in a run to heat a room [15:36:26] DZR: yeah, like the biolite :( [15:37:27] DZR: do you have schematic for the SD design? I'd really like to have a look at it to keep the design options open [15:37:32] I would very much like to build a stove with a steam boiler in it, to use witha tesla turbine for power-generation, and to recondense the water as a purification process... [15:38:20] thats also a good use of bpower [15:38:32] you could easily step a tlud unterneath a boiler [15:41:10] One thing that was posted to stoves a while ago, which is relevant to you, and I was surprised to read, was that stainless isnt as good a choice for stoves as you might think.... [15:41:28] cant remember the detail now..... [15:41:37] hmm, alternatives? [15:41:42] steel [15:42:04] but maybe stainless for your design.... not sure...... [15:42:07] larry dobson from ose suggested SiC ceramics, to build the chamber out of SiC [15:42:08] LXDE or XFCE folks, any comment? [15:43:05] maybe I can put steel in the middle and stainless for the outside, it would be good to know WHY the one and not the other:) [15:43:08] I use xfce [15:43:15] yeah anything that keeps the heat in is good... problem is cost and how easy to work with [15:43:24] but you should chose whatever you like best and are most comfortable with [15:43:31] I also wondered why stainless was wanted by chrono ;) For a furnace it might make sense, due to a higher melting point... [15:43:50] I used mat/board for jewelry making (mica I think???) for some of my combustion chamber [15:43:57] DZR: indeed, SiC would be great, but very hard to hack up by oneself [15:44:18] Also some high temp bricks that were 'rescued' from a shut down cement factory furnace [15:44:27] well, the tlud is gasifier and burner in one design, and to keep it working efficiently one has to keep the temperature high, 700+ [15:44:36] XFCE seems more popular, but I see that both Mint and Trisquel has LXDE as alternative to the gnome crap [15:45:28] my SD design is so I can refuel while it is running [15:45:30] thats why I came up with the elaborate helix design [15:45:35] I much ennjoyed Gnome2, but I hate Gnome3 with a passion, just as I puke on unity [15:45:59] in order to prolong the way secondary air has to travel before injection/combustion to heat it up [15:46:21] obviously; i'm not gonna keep Win7 on this netbook [15:52:42] gnome3 is kool just the desktop looks a bit weird [15:52:49] ;) [15:53:25] it seems that with buntu 12.04 u will be able to install a classic gnome desktop [15:53:48] this means a gnome desktop that is gnome3 but looks very the same like gnome2 [15:54:11] not like the fallback mode... [15:54:40] that would be preferble,m and migh get a few to actually return to using Gnome [15:54:47] guess they leart their lesson [15:54:51] yes many will [15:55:14] and probably mate is not anymore needed soon [15:55:25] DNS777: so what was it you started to use recently? [15:55:29] (i didnt install mate at all so far) [15:55:32] or tried out that you said you liked? [15:56:05] XFCE i use recently on trisquel 5.5 (beta) [15:56:24] aha [15:56:43] u can costomize xfce that it loks quite similar like old gnome desktop [15:56:50] *customize [15:56:52] tha Trisquel mini uses LXDE I see [15:57:33] lxde is good but xfce for me is better, because much easier to customize (without changin source code) [15:57:47] ah, right. [15:57:51] tnx [15:59:41] so is there a distro for it, or do I have to install it manually? [16:00:04] to install new desktop is quite easy y0 [16:00:16] sudo apt-get install xfce4 [16:00:30] still pondering on Trisquel vs Mint, I've run Triquel before, satisfied, but that was with gnome2 [16:00:34] xubuntu (xfce) and lubuntu (lxde) [16:00:36] right. [16:00:58] kalken: Canonical shit [16:01:08] well ppl should consider to use a 100% free distro [16:01:20] and drop proprietary linuxes [16:01:28] my wireless fucks with that karma [16:01:31] and my graphics [16:01:35] chrono - My stove is based (roughly) on this design http://www.newdawnengineering.com/website/library/Stoves/gtz7/ [16:01:36] URL Title: New Dawn Engineering - [16:02:04] Although its a bit hard to get a good idea of how it works from those drawings..... [16:02:23] kalken: this is a hardware issue not a free software issue.... it means the manufactor of that hardware didnt do any for free software community to be exact [16:02:36] you want to support such as companys? [16:02:43] me? [16:02:46] i run debian [16:02:48] always have [16:02:53] hahah ok [16:02:55] :) [16:03:18] it seems like people change distro because they dont like the default wallpaper [16:03:22] never understood that. [16:03:44] rofl [16:06:03] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIQXKrH46wI [16:06:04] You4Tube 2[Title] GNOME Classic in Ubuntu 12.04 2[Category] Howto 2[Duration] 0:01:49 2[Views] 9824 2[Rating] 4.90 2[Uploaded] 2012-03-21 2[Description] Getting a classic GNOME desktop in Ubuntu 12.04 is incredibly easy. [16:07:00] defuck ubuntu 101 xD [16:07:06] haha [16:07:29] but im happy to see a classic like gnome again there [16:07:32] i want to cry everytime i see that left panel [16:07:41] ya haha [16:08:06] (but for touchscreens its maybe not bad) [16:08:32] docky does a much better jobb if one wants big flashy bars [16:08:47] chrono this is kind of my stove (if you can open) http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20110129/c993cee5/attachment.jpg [16:09:08] i dont understand why they did not just take that, instead of spending a few thousand hours making something that is bad, and that screws with everything else [16:09:30] this unity feature that makes windows bar stick to the upper panel is nothing short of ridiculus [16:09:55] i want to cry even more everytime it happens [16:10:03] chrono - A section is basically a fuel hopper.... the fire starts at the bottom and burns sideways [16:10:33] kalken: what DE u use atm? [16:10:47] chrono B section is where most of the gases burn (insulated with fire bricks and mica sheet) Also where I start the fire as you would with TLUD stove [16:10:57] DNS777: i dont run graphics anymore [16:11:04] ssh is the shizz [16:11:13] kalken: honestly? [16:11:20] not even fluxbox? [16:11:24] ;D [16:11:26] hah [16:11:30] i only have servers [16:11:42] i have some ibad-thing that came with work... :( [16:11:47] and... if u want to watch a video? [16:11:59] xbmc [16:12:10] XD [16:12:27] its pretty awesome actually [16:12:32] DZR: a, cool, link works [16:12:32] runs stand alone these days [16:14:04] DZR: so you open the door in section b to ignite the process and fill more biomass from the top throught the hatch of section A? [16:14:21] DNS777: actually i was thinking about running framebuffer [16:14:30] mplayer works with that so :D [16:14:42] http://fluxbox.org/screenshots/screenshots_full/screenshot_bobbens.png [16:14:42] chrono it actually ended up a bit different to that... the grate the fire burns on is half in A section half in B section but it gives the idea... the heat exchanger parts are not necessary just sections A and B [16:14:57] hehe:) [16:15:02] i actually sort of know the guy who made fluxbox [16:15:05] through a friend [16:15:22] chrono the hole above the heat exchanger lets gases flow up the chimney to get the draw going. [16:15:24] nice! [16:16:22] As the burn increases most of the gases flow down (because that hole isnt big enough) past the heat exchanger [16:16:38] ah, I was wondering how that is going to be managed [16:17:22] chrono - I designed that stove for my living truck.... It turned out a bit heavier than I would have liked !!!! [16:18:27] DZR: I know, any design, not being a simple stove ultimately tends to get a little bit biger than one might think, that's why i stuck with TLUD, as it seemed most basic simple lightweight and versatile,and traded for automated fuel feeding [16:18:52] more like a doomsday device and a concept for people in developing nations to stop using open fires [16:19:35] I can use this one to heat and create power to run tools that might enable me to build something like the GEK apporach in the future [16:19:46] right now I try to go down to the most basic level und develop from there [16:19:57] even accepting manual refil :) [16:20:13] ,weather hamburg [16:20:14] Weather for Harburg, Hamburg on 1970-01-01 00:00UTC 2[Current:] 18℃, Clear, Wind: NW at 10 km/h, Humidity: 52% 2[Forecast:] Fri: Mostly Sunny ( 18℃ | 4℃ ), Sat: Partly Sunny ( 13℃ | 3℃ ), Sun: Fog ( 15℃ | 2℃ ), Mon: Fog ( 16℃ | 7℃ ) [16:20:18] whhaa [16:20:20] yeah manual refill for TLUD makes it easy :) [16:20:33] what the fo0k is wrong wit the date XD [16:20:55] google forgot to run ntpd? [16:20:57] :x [16:21:31] didnt realise you were looking to have fuel feeding....interesting :) [16:22:06] not for helios [16:24:06] saw that you said you cant weld for prototype [16:24:41] A friend told me about watching someone make a very neat stove using just a hammer and cold chisel !!! [16:24:45] but maybe later to have some GEK clas device with automatic feeding and separated gasification/combustion to generate something inbetween 1-3kw eletrical power + eccess heat usage (warm/water/water purification) to supply more than the basic Apollo-NG crew (events and such) [16:25:10] hehe [16:25:25] from thin sheet steel [16:25:51] I have neither skills nor eqip for welding unfortunately, But I hope to pick it up underway [16:25:53] I was also surprised that thin is not bad for steel in stoves (although probably not to thin....) [16:26:27] the thin metal can loose heat more quickly.... so less likely to melt [16:26:38] maybe caly can teach me a thing or two if we meeton the playing field [16:27:05] Stoves list is definitely a top resource.... great place for discussing your ideas [16:28:08] unless I'm mistaken there is also a sister gassifiers list [16:28:39] DZR: thanks for the link, I'll consider joining when I start actively working on it again, right now I have so much to to get out of here [16:29:01] Yeah Caly :) saw you plan to leave for Spain ..... where you headed??? [16:30:04] chrono .... I've hacked Bosch ECUs so if you want to start talking to your van I can help :) [16:30:17] DZR: NICE! [16:30:20] yes [16:30:24] definitely [16:30:47] I already have a prommer here that should also be able to help hacking them [16:31:16] batronix was nice enough to sponsor one, I needed for a pocsag radio transmitzter, and incidently all car hackers use this device to update ECU's as well [16:31:54] unfortunately it doesn't do CAN I'd really have liked to get into can, but it's still the analog systems, I have an adapter for, was already playing with it, talking to my CM :) [16:33:45] I dont code and guess you'll get a better understanding of what is going on than I did. I kind of trod the most well trod path [16:34:14] I got lots of interesting info tho some of which would no doubt be useful..... [16:35:26] *** Quits: Caly (Caly@RBOSE.org) (Connection closed) [16:38:08] I used a very cheap chip programming tool - the ECUs I was playing with you had to pull the chip from the ECU. With many of them you dont [16:38:44] I think that with yours you could probably play with the engine control via the OBD port? [17:04:16] *** Joins: Caly (Caly@RBOSE-43snh7.mobileonline.telia.com) [17:05:04] DZR: hang on, I was just about to pull up a video for a friend here... [17:05:37] chrono: shure, II'm basically self-tought from growing up in a workshop, but I could prolly show you a thing or two... [17:06:24] Caly: that's all I need mostly, somebody to show me something, than start doing it myself to get a feeling and than ask some question building on what I've learned so far [17:06:29] and then traing traing traing [17:06:36] training [17:19:32] DZR: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjF3n-AuzyM [17:19:33] You4Tube 2[Title] Millares - Spain Dec 2011 Visit - Montage 2[Category] Nonprofit 2[Duration] 0:02:07 2[Views] 633 2[Rating] 5.00 2[Uploaded] 2011-12-16 2[Description] Longer video with comments - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqT7t_tMyYE During this trip to Millares, Spain we looked at attainable land, abandoned land that could be used for growing food and fresh water springs amongst many other things. The strong winds make it a g [17:19:33] there [17:19:54] chrono: that's the way to go mate [17:20:04] *** Joins: iamme1112 (iamme@RBOSE-lfi.oi4.22.196.IP) [17:20:55] Caly: [17:20:56] nice [17:21:05] wanna leave sooner :9 [17:21:15] leave? [17:21:26] to join me there? =P [17:21:31] jep [17:22:16] Caly Millares.... I wouldn't of guessed... although you did go there for the OSEE visit?? [17:27:50] yeah, I'min the clip there. [17:33:18] I hope to get to Spain this year.... was going to check Ces Le Fou, Open E Land and Marinaleda [17:33:21] Caly [17:33:50] open e land is also an otpion for me [17:34:20] but I will make up my mind when the time comes [17:34:27] Guess I need to add Millares... didnt realise there was anyone planning to head there... what is the plan there? [17:34:38] if I don't feel comfortable I could just try something else then :9 [17:40:33] *** Quits: iamme1112 (iamme@RBOSE-lfi.oi4.22.196.IP) (Ping timeout: 241 seconds) [17:44:43] *** Joins: iamme1112 (iamme@RBOSE-lfi.oi4.22.196.IP) [17:44:46] *** Quits: DZR (Darren@RBOSE-cvq.271.4.190.IP) (Quit: Leaving) [17:45:38] *** Joins: DZR (Darren@RBOSE-cvq.271.4.190.IP) [17:58:57] *** Quits: iamme1112 (iamme@RBOSE-lfi.oi4.22.196.IP) (Ping timeout: 241 seconds) [18:00:44] Anyone know much about X chat???? [18:01:13] *** Joins: iamme1112 (iamme@RBOSE-lfi.oi4.22.196.IP) [18:01:30] x chat? [18:01:38] IRC client [18:01:47] i only use irsii [18:02:17] on a always on shell within screen or tmux you can attach/detach whenever you like and never missanything (scrollback) [18:03:00] and you can also connect to it from an android phone via irsii-connectbot, that's really a nice feature [18:03:11] weechat can that too [18:03:21] true [18:03:25] but bncs i like more for that [18:03:30] is a cli client too, right? [18:03:47] yes [18:03:55] https://launchpad.net/~dns/+archive/irc [18:03:56] had a look at weechat ..... terminal is a bit crazy for me.... I no code... xchat is nice GUI [18:04:00] URL Title: IRC : DNS [18:04:11] there are some clients:) [18:04:18] DZR: don't be scared of the cli, it has nothing to do with coding :) [18:04:28] cli = ?? [18:04:33] ?cli [18:04:40] 'w cli [18:04:42] it might take a little getting used to, but ultimately, in the long run, your processes get way more efficient and flued with a cli tool [18:04:43] command line interface [18:04:48] cli = command line interface [18:04:53] what dns aid [18:06:02] aha.... yeah sure.... but feels more clunky + takes some adjusting to terminal stuff after years of windows [18:06:24] I did start out a long time back using MS-DOS so not completely alien [18:06:26] *** Quits: Caly (Caly@RBOSE.org) (Ping timeout: 241 seconds) [18:07:59] anyway my immediate problem.... [18:08:05] DZR: I know, but believe me, once you've overcome your habit things really go smoothly, it takes a little while to train the brain again to this level of interaction if you are used to working with mouse only :) [18:08:45] you can use mouse with weechat btw [18:09:07] just give it a try:) [18:09:26] /mouse anable [18:09:31] /mouse enable [18:11:02] on restart X-chat used to (under windows) show channel tree with networks and channels at next level [18:11:43] now running mint it shows one channel on the network and the rest of the channels on that network on the next level..... [18:12:40] the problem is that it doesnt show the old data in the 'root' channel when I restart [18:13:35] I've tried messing about and if I leave a network and rejoin on another channel I do get old conversations from when that channel was not 'root' [18:14:05] ... the one that was previously root..... if I'm making any sense at all???? [18:14:32] i was never a big xchat fan, but i like it with its script / plugin system [18:14:48] *** Joins: woyna (woyna@RBOSE-ukl.r5g.133.79.IP) [18:15:21] not played with that yet but was going to have a look [18:15:27] if you want a very customizable irc leint with gui you should try kvirc [18:15:36] leint=client [18:16:37] *** Quits: woyna (woyna@RBOSE-ukl.r5g.133.79.IP) (Quit: changing servers) [18:17:16] heh that looks like psybnc [18:17:17] :> [18:17:39] kvirc .... I'll make a note... gonna have a look at xchat scripts/plugin stuff [18:18:39] i personally prefer konversation because easy to use clean interface,... and not a big deal to run it under gnome, xfce or lxde [18:18:46] for gui [18:19:05] without gui i prefer weechat:) still otehr clietns have interesting features too [18:19:48] OK I'll also check konversation [18:20:15] :D [18:20:56] I'll find something I like I guess ???? [18:21:06] Or I'll learn to like something [18:21:28] there are some clients you could try [18:21:31] certainly xchat is better than tinyirc which I was using before under windows [18:22:26] hehe:) [18:23:11] also smuxi, quassel, loqui and tekka have graphical interface [18:23:26] and lostirc (which isnt in development anymore it seems) [18:29:00] i will go outside and get some frresh air, bbl:) [18:32:59] *** Quits: iamme1112 (iamme@RBOSE-lfi.oi4.22.196.IP) (Connection closed) [18:34:35] *** Joins: iamme1112 (iamme@RBOSE-lfi.oi4.22.196.IP) [18:37:25] *** Joins: ZyaX (9jti8d8@RBOSE-5lntnm.bredband.comhem.se) [18:48:08] *** Quits: iamme1112 (iamme@RBOSE-lfi.oi4.22.196.IP) (Connection closed) [18:57:55] *** Joins: Caly (Caly@RBOSE-ar0p9l.mobileonline.telia.com) [18:58:12] DZR: Ca La Fou is way cool. [18:59:03] chrono: OEL might GET to bee cool in time, I was part of the five man strong core team in the preparations, but I got out of it due to their total inability to plan and be rational/realistic. [18:59:03] yeah [19:00:19] I wonder whats been happening there since Nikoli visited.... wish I could speak Spanish... am learning a bit... [19:00:32] The guy I liked there, Ezequel, is working on the serious planning at a distance, when he produces something tangible together with the land owner, I might be interested again. The guys that was there building is not for me to toeam up with, to be honest. [19:01:10] Idk Chris, but the other guy I met in Millares, and he's focusing on the entirely wrong thing in a backwads order [19:01:44] speaking from experiance, I have run both non-profits (founder/chairman) as well as my own companies, and with my fathers companies, etc etc. [19:02:34] and ofc, BROSE is all baout rational smart planning, given it was formed out of disdain from other organisations we took part of that did seriously bad/flawed planning/organisation. [19:03:12] but still, it's an interesting piece of land no doubt, and the owner is really reasonable and so, but are currently very preoccupied with his own business. [19:04:51] Caly what are the plans for Millaires??? [19:05:29] Caly: I think elf-pavlik also mentioned some reservations about OEL but never elaborated [19:05:38] You will be working with Jesus I guess? [19:10:15] yeah, I prolly will [19:49:59] Caly prolly??? But you have a plan I guess? If not with Jesus what you planning to do / where you planning to stay? [19:56:19] !dance [19:56:20] ACTION shakes her ass and shows the Boogie-Woogie with DNS777 in #RBOSE [19:56:34] the weather was/is really nice today [19:56:44] well, I don't have a clear picture, but I'll certainly cooperate with him. He's english is pretty crappy, so communication has mainly been through google translete so far, and he seldom reads his mail, but he seems very interested and cooperative indeed [19:57:34] DZR: yeah, I guess elf-pavlik has been following the project and my comments about my involvement, an as such he might even be a bit baised =P [19:59:07] Caly think that should have been aimed at chrono but interesting none the less..... [19:59:09] btw guys i wonder if we should meet more frequently in mumble again? [19:59:28] can be sometimes better than just text-chat:) [19:59:40] Caly still interested why you chose Millaires? [20:00:11] !w Millaires [20:00:15] The page "Millaires" does not exist. You can ask for it to be created, but consider checking the search results below to see whether the topic is already covered. For search help, please visit Help:Searching. [20:00:18] :o [20:00:58] I really like the fact that Ca La Fou and Marinaleda have established communities willing to support [20:01:49] .... OSE type work although I guess it means that their existing cultures have to be worked with.... [20:02:01] ... Although they appear to be reasonable. [20:02:57] DNS777 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjF3n-AuzyM [20:02:58] You4Tube 2[Title] Millares - Spain Dec 2011 Visit - Montage 2[Category] Nonprofit 2[Duration] 0:02:07 2[Views] 633 2[Rating] 5.00 2[Uploaded] 2011-12-16 2[Description] Longer video with comments - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqT7t_tMyYE During this trip to Millares, Spain we looked at attainable land, abandoned land that could be used for growing food and fresh water springs amongst many other things. The strong winds make it a g [20:03:20] ok so typo [20:03:24] !w Millares [20:03:25] ..... sorry I spelt wrong !!! [20:03:27] Millares | Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Millares&oldid=472012243" Categories: Municipalities in the Province of Valencia. Canal de Navarrés. Populated places in the Province of Valencia. Valencian Community geography stubs. @ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millares [20:05:06] DNS777 I tend to be a bit scared of audio on internet. I've often got limited data or slow connections. [20:06:08] Although obviously that shouldnt stop others... and thinking about it my circumstances are very likely to alter [20:12:01] DNS777: haha, I've just compiled mumble to have a talk with nikolay and alex (ose) [20:12:24] never have used it before, but it looks nice, probably will set up an apollo-ng mumble server as well :) [20:14:25] DZR: VoIP is the futere, and it already works quite well, if you consider what type of bandwith you've got and set your client accordingly. speex does an okay job regarding voice compression [20:15:27] and it makes us free from any telco based telephony depenency, you can just hang on any WiFi access point you can find and hook into :)) [20:15:51] muhahaha :) [20:16:21] I've used mumble before and Skype.... Still use them when I'm on wifi/LAN worry about data limits when using 3G (normally much of the time) [20:17:03] oh i forgot to say that i made a temp mumble ppa again [20:17:05] yeah, data limits, wtf, I would worry too if I had to pay for traffic again... [20:17:14] because tehres no oneiric or precise builds [20:17:34] ???? [20:17:39] https://launchpad.net/~rbose-debianizer/+archive/mumble [20:17:41] URL Title: Mumble : “RBOSE Debianizer” team [20:17:54] >_< [20:23:17] http://tinvillage.wikispaces.com/ UK festival crew [20:23:19] URL Title: tinvillage - home [20:36:06] *** Quits: Caly (Caly@RBOSE.org) (Ping timeout: 241 seconds) [20:46:37] //\oo/\\\ [20:46:50] a spider which lost a leg [21:55:44] Its got a bit of corporate shine but this future scenario from Sony is interesting http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=WiTms8egg6o [22:13:20] *** Joins: Caly (Caly@RBOSE-v1g3d9.mobileonline.telia.com) [22:14:13] DNS777: It's not Millaires, just Millares [22:15:08] ah, ok, you got it. *reading up* [22:18:39] DZR: you know about Jesus because... ? [22:19:13] Have I missed you beeing at the same trip as me or sumthin' ? [22:19:44] through the OSEE mail list... or was I following you???? [22:20:22] wo0t [22:20:32] JESUUUUS?! [22:21:35] Hes a bloke with a beard and hes got time for everyone [22:26:15] !hammer DZR [22:26:16] ACTION slaps DZR with a big |-| /-\ /\/\ /\/\ /-\ of hard informations (Only because DNS777 requested that.) [22:26:50] :D [22:27:49] Sorry Caly knows him.... I've only read about him [22:29:03] I can turn the other cheek for missboty however [22:30:58] He lives at / close to Millares was inviting OSE type folk to do stuff there. [22:31:18] DZR: Well, people got some skewed misconceptions about Jesus I think, I think he's a standup guy, and will work with him in some form or another, prolly even in Sicania Nova (the worker collective he's trying to establish) [22:33:00] As for choosing Millares, well, first of all I got to meet the people there, so I allready have some connection so to speak. I relly liked the whole-heartedness of Alba with whom I stayed there, and her mentality about hings in general. [22:33:41] There are other resons too, like, she offered me to come and stay in this moment, when my situation worsened to a point of no income and no home. [22:34:56] I think Millares has good potential, as it's a small "dying" village community, pretty much based on the now shut down textile factory, crying for things to happen. [22:36:28] I also plainly loved the nature there, the ountain terrain, still with warm climate. The fact that its somewhat surrounded by a big natural reserve, the fact that there are allready a big enough workshop for almost anything I could think of doing, wich for instance, OEL does not have. [22:37:07] Other than Jesus infrequent posts to the OSEE mail list I hadnt heard it mentioned much since the 'gathering' there [22:39:16] gotta do some stuff [22:39:36] I recently came to know about Ca La Fou, but rents there are high, and the approach seems to be on bigger scale manufacturing, whist I'm more keen on small scale decentralised local manufaturing, and also,, in Millares they have allready started growing food for self-sustainability for us few that are gonna work there. [22:40:20] DZR: ok, I stopped following the newsgroup, due to it beeing google. [22:41:11] And yeah, most everyone else rejected Millares due to mis understandings, mostly by poor communication skills, language barriers and utterly poor preparations before the trip. [22:43:24] Also, Spanish burocracy messed up ownership information on the lands, so it appeared like Finca De Cavas was owned by an energy company, wich it isn't, It's owned by the city (village) and are as such claimable for indefiniteser rights by residents. [22:44:40] Most people simply thought that that part was a lie and that Jesus was marely looking for people to help up the economy of Sicania Nova, but that is mainly maintained by EU money afaik. [22:45:13] Bu all in all, it's mostly a question of timing and gut feeling. [22:46:39] as of now, I might just as well be there as here, and I'm firmy set on moving to Spain (and from Sweden) so I might just as well get to it and learn the language. I can allways go to Ca La Fou or some other community if things don't turn out as expected [22:48:55] hmm [22:49:06] so jesus is now in spain? [22:49:21] and how old is he? 2012 years? [22:49:25] lol [22:49:46] Well, he lives in Millares, heads the Sicania Nova, runs a small shop there, and are maintainer of the old factory buildings. [22:50:05] dunno, about 55-60 perhaps, hard to tell [22:50:27] he used to be the head mechanic at the factory [22:50:43] sorry i was just wondering about the name [22:50:45] :D [22:50:54] hehe [22:51:11] it's prenounced he-suz [23:24:29] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_qcQ4OElhM [23:24:30] You4Tube 2[Title] REPUBLICAN RAP BATTLE (by Dan Bull) 2[Category] News 2[Duration] 0:01:26 2[Views] 301 2[Rating] 4.93 2[Uploaded] 2012-03-23 2[Description] Download Dan's free album: http://itsdanbull.com/face Subscribe to Dan on YouTube: http://youtube.com/douglby Like Dan on Facebook: http://facebook.com/itsDanBull Follow Dan on Twitter: http://twitter.com/itsDanBull Circle Dan on G+: http://goo.gl/b8N35 Credits: Produced by Ben [23:36:37] Everyone down at the pub or sumthin' ? [23:39:25] *** Quits: ZyaX (9jti8d8@RBOSE-5lntnm.bredband.comhem.se) (Ping timeout: 241 seconds)